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How to switch off traction control completely?


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I have a question;

Why the insistence on driving on sideslopes deliberately, but more to the point, why the insistence on driving on sideslopes with vehicles that were not designed for it? Worse though, why drive on sideslopes deliberately with softroaders like Pajero's that have very high centres of gravity?

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38 minutes ago, wildcat said:

I have a question;

Why the insistence on driving on sideslopes deliberately, but more to the point, why the insistence on driving on sideslopes with vehicles that were not designed for it? Worse though, why drive on sideslopes deliberately with softroaders like Pajero's that have very high centres of gravity?

Wildcat,

The pajero is not even close to a soft roader, and it's center of gravity is seriously better than a Wrangler or an FJ.. it is a superior one and it is better designed than all the bunch.. their air intake design, water and dust trap in the intake is a work of art, it is a very well thought off offroader that is great for sand!

Pajero, if you don't know, is the king of Dakar, Gen2 and Gen3 ruled it for years until Mitsu decided to race the Lancer variant there.. and it was unbeatable.. Gen4 (current Paj) is not different than Gen3.. it is one of the very best desert SUVs.. it is only let down by it is below class engine output, which is reliable, but is not as powerful as the FJ/Xterra/Prado/wrangler... etc.

Still, it can do everything, many marshals drove Pajeros, and some still do in many clubs...

Pajeros have Low range transfer case, rear lockable Difflock, and one of the best traction controls in the business.. only relatively recently Toyota and Nissan caught up with it with ATRAC and ABLS respectively.. 

Pajero is an icon, and it is a great all purpose truck, I bought one for the wife and I take it for family offroading trips where my Xterra is left for hardcore and have many gear and equipment occupying family space, I purely decided to make the Xterra my main offroad truck because of engine power, nothing else!

regarding side sloping, it is a basic technique, we take Pajeros to far more advanced stuff, side cresting, big ones, and fast ones with 80 Km/h speed side crests done on big dunes.. it is awesome.. if only it had more power I would make it my main offroader!

Edited by ayman_khateeb
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3 hours ago, Jayesh.delani said:

That was a helpful post.

Are there diff locks in Pajero 2014 model 3.6 ? :o 

 

I guess you mean 3.5.

in the recent years, the agency limited their imports with full traction control/ Difflock to the 3.8 engine.

if you have the 3.8, you should have a button in front of the gearbox with R/D written on it, it only activates in 4Llc, when  you try to activate it, a small dot will blink between the rear tires on the dashboard, once all the lights are solid, then it is now engaged

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The strange thing with Pajeros is that while everything you say is true,  I have yet to see one complete an African transcontinental trip. I have completed more than 200 000 kms crossing Africa in all directions over the past fifteen  years or so, and the only Pajeros we ever see are broken ones. 

As for the Dakar- you must remember that all teams have massive technical support, which can make anything complete, and even win the event. You mus also remeber that the Pajeros competing in the Dakar bear very little technical resemblance to the production models ordinary peope can buy. 

Pajeros may be perfect for dune bashing, but all SUV's are useless in serious off roading driving conditions where there is no technical back-up, no spare engines, no spare  transmissions, or a dozen mechanics available to repair any break downs. You may want to try some real off-roading on a grade 5 trail- I think you will change you mind about what makes a real off road vehicle.

I am also an accredited off road driving instructor, and my experience with Pajeros and other soft roaders have been uniformly bad, and these days I refuse to take any SUV on even grade three trails, simply because they do not have the suspension articulation and flexibility required to cope with seriously uneven terrain. Moreover, they have too many electronics and driver assist systems, and disabling the ABS to make them safe to drive off road is more trouble than it is worth. 

I should perhaps also mention that you cannot fit a winch to a Pajero without extensive modifications, which makes it useless as a serious off road vehicle.

I don't think we are talking about the same thing when we speak of off road driving, but you should perhaps put a Pejero to a real test sometime.

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25 minutes ago, wildcat said:

The strange thing with Pajeros is that while everything you say is true,  I have yet to see one complete an African transcontinental trip. I have completed more than 200 000 kms crossing Africa in all directions over the past fifteen  years or so, and the only Pajeros we ever see are broken ones. 

As for the Dakar- you must remember that all teams have massive technical support, which can make anything complete, and even win the event. You mus also remeber that the Pajeros competing in the Dakar bear very little technical resemblance to the production models ordinary peope can buy. 

Pajeros may be perfect for dune bashing, but all SUV's are useless in serious off roading driving conditions where there is no technical back-up, no spare engines, no spare  transmissions, or a dozen mechanics available to repair any break downs. You may want to try some real off roading on a grade 5 trail- I think you will change you mind about what makes a real off road vehicle.

I am also an accredited off road driving instructor, and my experience with Pajeros and other soft roaders have been uniformly bad, and these days I refuse to take any SUV on even grade three trails, simply because they do not have the suspension articulation and flexibility required to cope with seriously uneven terrain. Moreover, they have too many electronics and driver assist systems, and disabling the ABS to make them safe to drive off road is more trouble than it is worth. 

I should perhaps also mention that you cannot fit a winch to a Pajero without extensive modifications, which makes it useless as a serious off road vehicle.

I don't think we are talking about the same thing when we speak of off road driving, but you should perhaps put a Pejero to a real test sometime.

Yes, we are really talking about different types of offroading, and you need to stop shoehorning your own irrelevant experience into this.. it is a wide spectrum of activities, advice will vary based on the type and the intended use.

we are not talking about rock crawling here, we are talking about sand driving... and what you are describing is becoming more like a purpose built crawler rather than a daily driver.. so let's not go their..

your comment and "question" about side sloping and pajero "high center of gravity" just shows that you are not experienced in this type of "offroading". which is not a problem, I have zero experience in rock crawling, and I don't go and start discussing that topic because I don't have the practical experience. in the sand I do exactly know what I'm talking about, and for the Pajero specifically as I own one and know how it handles the sand.

I respect your knowledge and experience in the other type of offroading, but it is totally different, while the overall knowledge and nature respect is transferable, the technical knowledge is not, at least not immediately, and what works there might work differently in the sand.

your statement about big mods for a winch is false, big time.. it is no different than practically any SUV.. you need a winch bumper, for any truck, and for the Pajero you can get the ARB one which fits directly. actually you can buy it ready from the agency under the name Pajero Adventure edition, with 2" lift and ARB bumper fitted in the local agency, just add a winch.

I don't really want to argue much, but your articles and advices are based on different offroading, and it doesn't fit in this case as well as other cases. for example the advice for choosing an offroad vehicle article is valid for a specific type of offroading, and it is invalid for the MAIN type of offroading here which is sand, yet you write the article as if it is an absolute truth and as it is one size fits all..

it is not!

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I may be able to clear some facts and misunderstanding here. I own 1999 model Pajero SWB with 3.5 engine and used extensively for off-road since last 5 years. In my honest opinion Pajero is a good off-roader if you mod them properly.

  • Dakar Pajero and consumer models are POLES APART, Mitsubishi doesn't even put a fraction of that performance in consumer models.
  • Pajero's are not good for aggressive off-road, I put that to test 3 years back and fried up my engine with all the possible years of off-road experience and knowledge I had.
  • Pajero's design after 2003 model is more appealing to on-road drivers than off-road drivers due to fancy low hanging front and rear bumpers. Every off-road drive I did with post 2003 stock pajero will scoop out tons of sand and eventually on 2-3 drive bumper will fall apart. Few of my friends have done some good modification for adding the custom metal plate behind bumpers to reinforce the installation and prevent sand scooping.
  • Post 2003 model Pajero approach and exit angles are horrible for sand dunes if you go serious dune bashing it will break the bumper in couple of attempts made above 60-80 kmph without 2 inch lift installed.
  • Go to bidayer, faya, wagan or liwa and witness not more than 5% cars are Pajero, rest all is LC, patrol, FJC, Xterra and wranglers. You may find few in  pink rock and tawi nizwa (beginner areas).
  • Having said all the above if person really want to build a Pajero with custom lift, wider tires, bumper reinforcement, skid plates, additional electric fan as they heat up little bit very fast on slightest push, then they do perform good.
  • Pajero engine is not actually underpower atleast in my case, however I felt Nissan Patrol SWB 2006 model quite underpower for 4.5 liter. I was not able to climb faya from front side with patrol, but I could do same with my Pajero.
  • Pajero sport is the mix of outlander and older Pajero design that offers good ground clearance in stock shape.

Sorry husain1 for so much thread jacking, but I think it's a good knowledge exchange here.

Let's root for each other & watch each other grow.

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I fully agree with Gaurav, but allow me to share one last bit of irrelevant information here before we call it quits-

Apart from rock crawling, which is something I have never done, the fact is that the more you modify a vehicle, the less reliable it becomes. So to perform extensive modifications just to get some performance and handling from a vehicle intended for off road use is a really bad idea. Oh, and there is a lot of sand in Africa too!

Thanks guys, it is always interesting to learn about other experiences and ways of doing things. 

Edited by wildcat
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9 hours ago, wildcat said:

I fully agree with Gaurav, but allow me to share one last bit of irrelevant information here before we call it quits-

Apart from rock crawling, which is something I have never done, the fact is that the more you modify a vehicle, the less reliable it becomes. So to perform extensive modifications just to get some performance and handling from a vehicle intended for off road use is a really bad idea. Oh, and there is a lot of sand in Africa too!

Thanks guys, it is always interesting to learn about other experiences and ways of doing things. 

It is always good to have a discussion with different people across the globe..

We are not talking about extensive mods, we are talking about "protection" ones..

a bolt on bumper & similar rear protection, which every truck in the desert need, including Jeep Wrangler.. But each of course to different degree..

Take a look at my truck in the profile pic, it is completely stock except for the bumper & the LED lights, which didn't invalidate my warranty even with the pain in the a*% Local Nissan dealers..

although I would LOVE to change the stock suspension, but better to keep my warranty as long as it lasts!

i agree with the Gaurav experience and comments, but it is nearly the same negatives for all other brands.. 

All car brands will destroy an engine once the truck is old & you push it, it happened around me with nissans, toyotas & mitsubishis.. Toyotas tend to last a bit longer, but all the same fate eventually..

I never saw any popular SUV in the desert that doesn't need some kind of extra protection..

Xterra? Dangerously exposed radiator & flemsi skid plate, a proper skid plate is a must, I went for full bumper for more aggressive offroad driving style than usual..

FJ? Same, front bumper sides always gets a dang when things goes beyond smooth cruising, & the front skid plate is too thin & too low that it gets bent in a few drives

nissan Patrol y61? Plastic bumpers front and back gets a hit easily.. But protection is not a functional must

pajero has a very exposed rear bumper lip, I always take it off for anyone joining my drive, a few screws.. Front bumper needs some "decoration" work to remove the lower lip.. But nothing more than cosmetics here 😁 .. Still a negative for sure

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