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ethan

Automatic Vs Manual Part Duex

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Oooh...what an interesting conversation, wonder how I missed it the first time round. Lemme put in my own two cents into this.

As most of you know, I worked for a decade as a Safari Tour Guide, learned to drive on road and then off road on a manual, more specifically a Land Cruiser Pickup, used for hauling really heavy stuff deep into the dunes.

As work required I was pretty much working 7 days a week during season time and 3-4 times a wee during the 3-4 months summer off peaks months. 

I was also from the camp, that manual is the best and only girls and whips do autos, and TBH actually scared and not very confident to take an auto off road into the dunes, so for many many years I avoided autos likes the plague. But later caved in after thinking rationally that I spent more time stuck in city traffic than in the dunes so got an automatic, which was  considered a pretty big no no in my field that time and all my colleagues went, what have you done, you will regret it, but I went ahead anyways and the rest is history.

And to this day I can say I don't regret a single second of that choice, there was never a single moment where I though. I wish I had a manual right about now. But there were countless moments where I did find myself saying, than god I've got an auto and not a manual.

To me people who complain about Autos performance in the dune, to me simply just don't know how to drive with an auto properly and like Gaurav. 99.9% of the time my selector was or is in D hi range. Learn your car and its transmission and you wont have any problems

Now not blowing my own horn, I actually got pretty nifty with gear shifts in a manual, a lot clients even commented on this after the drive, they were impressed. One of my tricks was not lift my foot of the clutch, but just slide it to the side and pedal comes up with its own force  combine that with quick shifts of the lever, so gearshift times were not my gripes about manuals. 

To conclude let me just say not all manuals and auto are created equally, all have different rations and shift point and even different purposes. And to me auto or manual really does not add or take away any pleasure or performance of driving off road, unless its something really stupid which is usually because some manufacturer thought XYZ would be a good idea. Like for example we were given the new facelifted 2005 Patrol for testing in Liwa and the model we got was an auto with triptronic gears, was a big deal back then, So in this huge bowl. I put in 2nd, went down got some good speed on the downhill then started to climb half way up, it started to lose speed and power, so dropped or tried atleast to drop in 1st and the cars computer wouldn't let me because at the speed I would be over revving in 1st gear. So I needless to say right close to the top car stopped. :/ 

Earlier in life I prefered manuals and was told by everyone autos are the devils spawn but once I tried them now my personal choice is auto for all situations. And would avoid manuals if I had the choice. Like Barry says hes only ever owned one car with an auto, so naturally his bias is towards Manuals, Because I myself was like that as Ive explained earlier So as the saying goes don't knock it unless you've tried it.


 

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2 hours ago, shadow79 said:

we had a live demonstration of automatic vs manual on friday with both the cherokees in the group when @skumar83 climbed the iftar bowl in all his attempts and @sertac with his automatic one failed a few times when @Gaurav tried it went up could be because of the driver and cars having different set of tyres and driving style as sertac is afterall new to all this then sri is according to experience...

In all honesty, it was not a fair comparison of Auto vs Manual in last Friday hill climb. Sertac Cherokee auto box is having 1&2 together in gearstick that leaves no option for him to shift to 1st gear on the extreme long hill climb. Secondly, his car suspension really need good work, and I was losing a lot of good momentum as soon as I hit the cross track and if you remember how much struggle I have gone through the back face of Iftar bowl. Thirdly although I did climb Iftar bowl from the front, but it was in LO gear and not in High - most preferred gear for the long hill climb.

Auto is best for Sand, only if the auto box offer manual shifting to 1st gear and able to hold that first gear even till 7K rpm.

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Some good points made @desertdude  

Maybe I have an aversion to automatics because the majority of my experience is with manuals. I grew up with it. I feel what the car is doing. It is second nature to me.

But I can see the point where autos make sense for some people around the city. For me, it really doesn't bother me. I'm so used to manuals that shifting gears and clutching is second nature to me. I've driven 40 foot articulated trucks through Belfast and Dublin. I picked up a customers car a while back, auto SLK and had to take it across Dubai to a workshop and honestly, it scared the crap out of me. 2 pedals, go and stop. I just didn't feel in control. I don't like driving along and pressing the throttle then the engine revs up itself. Then when you're accelerating, you don't know if it's going to change gear or keep revving until it blows up. I'm sorry, but autos just aren't for me. I've only owned one but I've driven plenty in my time but I prefer manual and that's just the way it is.

I haven't got a lot of desert experience. I've only driven a few times but the times I have, it has been in a manual. I was able to apply my experience from home in the snow, rocking the clutch and getting myself out of holes. I also have clutchless shifts down to a tee. If I'm going up a hill and the engine is dying, I can rev match and drop a gear in one action or if I'm cruising, I can go up the gears without the clutch. 

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1 hour ago, desertdude said:

To me people who complain about Autos performance in the dune, to me simply just don't know how to drive with an auto properly and like Gaurav. 99.9% of the time my selector was or is in D hi range. Learn your car and its transmission and you wont have any problems

1

Read the whole thread again buddy, to understand what I have been saying since page 1. You probably read it very fast - like always :-)

I'm the only one who has been fighting for the Auto box in the sand, in front of others who have never tried both in sand or at least not tried the right gearbox.

I too learned from the 2006 manual Patrol - disaster gearbox who couldn't even climb big red halfway, let alone the Iftar bowl and Faya.

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2 minutes ago, Gaurav said:

 

Auto is best for Sand, only if the auto box offer manual shifting to 1st gear and able to hold that first gear even till 7K rpm.

So auto is only best under certain conditions. The ones that are offered by manuals 100% of the time?

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1 minute ago, Barry said:

So auto is only best under certain conditions. The ones that are offered by manuals 100% of the time?

Nope, that's not the case but its other way around. Just like manual gear need practice, the same goes for the auto box and an experienced driver with the auto box can do "EVERYTHING that manual can do + Do a better hill climb" :-)

Manual is good for beginners in the sand to do self-recovery by rocking and crawling out of the situations, whereas auto can do all these but need a little experience and guidance to exactly what manual gear can do.

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@Gaurav another point to be added is whether you have the option of '1' and NOT '1-2' for long Hill climb in an auto car. I drove an Xterra up Iftar Bowl and it was easy mainly because you had the option to select only 1st gear. The auto upshifting is the main issue with an auto car in my opinion

 

P.S. I just read your earlier post and you had covered this point. So just a repeat

Edited by skumar83

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1 minute ago, skumar83 said:

@Gaurav another point to be added is whether you have the option of '1' and NOT '1-2' for long Hill climb in an auto car. I drove an Xterra up Iftar Bowl and it was easy mainly because you had the option to select only 1st gear. The auto upshifting is the main issue with an auto car in my opinion

Totally agree Sri and that's what I meant above to be in 1st gear when needed. Btw, Xterra, Pajero, Pathy are not a rare breed but actual offroaders designed with a well-thought auto gearbox.

Sorry Sertac but auto Cherokee has this weird issue I just realized it on Friday and actually understood why Manual Cherokees are expensive than Auto in that year range.

It is nothing to do with actual Manual vs Auto fight, but all about bad design offered by Jeep in that year. Maybe you can research on this topic and really consider a smarter auto box from another year Cherokee if that auto box is designed with 1 and 2 in the separate selector.

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Pajero also is a culprit to this screwup. I owned one. 

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Just now, skumar83 said:

Pajero also is a culprit to this screwup. I owned one. 

Newer one yes, as they moved away from real offroaders to the soft-roaders segment to sell more

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