Carnity Whats-app Group, Sharing important Docs

[Jefy]

Is it maybe an idea to share important docs in the Off-road whatsapp group?

Like;

-Frequencies
-How to guides
-Emergency numbers (UAE rescue, Police, Hospitals)

I think this will be an added value, docs are instant accessible, instead of going to the forum and search the correct topic.

When posting a new drive, you can make the members aware that they can find the documents with the applicable info in the WhatsApp group.

Food for thought.

[Wrangeld]

Good initiative, but still requires people to actually read them. 

I feel that the challenge is not so much accessibility of the documents but the fact the people who probably most need to read them don't, and won't no matter how accessible.  

Will every fewbie arrive at the drive Friday with all the equipment needed to drive as a fewbie? I have my doubts - because they likely stopped reading at 'you have been promoted'. 

The question on my mind is how do we achieve a situation where everyone has that sense of responsibility that when driving 4x4 it's not just about what 'I' want and more about the fact there are other people involved who depend on you knowing what to do and having the right kit. 

[Jefy]

I am not concerned about who is reading it or not, it is more a perspective of practicability and the use of technology we have.

If you go to an existing WhatsApp conversation, you can access "Media, Links, and Docs". Instant access without the necessity to have internet.

What if you are in the desert and you don't have access to internet, but you need to find something (Nearest Hospital), what about that on one day the internet/social media is scrambled due to tensions in this region but you need to reach one of the emergency numbers?

The forum is run on internet traffic and I understand it is preferable/ necessary to gain traffic on the site. 

Just food for thought! (Just thinking a bit of redundancy when the technology is available)

 

[Javier M]

11 hours ago, Wrangeld said:

Good initiative, but still requires people to actually read them. 

I feel that the challenge is not so much accessibility of the documents but the fact the people who probably most need to read them don't, and won't no matter how accessible.  

Will every fewbie arrive at the drive Friday with all the equipment needed to drive as a fewbie? I have my doubts - because they likely stopped reading at 'you have been promoted'. 

The question on my mind is how do we achieve a situation where everyone has that sense of responsibility that when driving 4x4 it's not just about what 'I' want and more about the fact there are other people involved who depend on you knowing what to do and having the right kit. 

In other groups your equipment is inspected and you do not get the promotion until you actually show you have the driving skill and equipment required to drive at the next level. If you are late you will be left and you won't be allowed to participate since you are wasting the time of the people that are there on time.

I don't think this would be the case for carnity since it is a more relaxed group in that sense. It is a difficult question on how to get the right balance of accountability vs creating a relaxed environment and luckily I do not get a saying on that.

To @Xaf's point, I think the best way would be to create a manual with the most important information, all of this info would be available in the forum for download, instead of having it spread on different pieces. This way you can either print it or have it on our phone for your review. This way if you needed to update/add one thing you would just update the manual and people can go and download the latest version.

[Jefy]

27 minutes ago, Javier M said:

To @Xaf's point, I think the best way would be to create a manual with the most important information, all of this info would be available in the forum for download, instead of having it spread on different pieces. This way you can either print it or have it on our phone for your review. This way if you needed to update/add one thing you would just update the manual and people can go and download the latest version.

@Javier M You are right, that is even better. One main source on the forum, easily found to download the latest version of a manual. 

@Javier M Would it be smart to put the frequencies in such document with the threat it can spread around and might be used against the group in a court case?

[Javier M]

1 minute ago, Xaf said:

@Javier M You are right, that is even better. One main source on the forum, easily found to download the latest version of a manual. 

@Javier M Would it be smart to put the frequencies in such document with the threat it can spread around and might be used against the group in a court case?

The manual can have some liability clauses, and the stuff in the manual would not be different as the stuff in this forum so the same laws apply. 

[Rahimdad]

@Xaf and @Javier M thank you for your suggestions.

@Wrangeld I totally agree with your point of view.

I am sorry @Javier M if any of us ever gave you a feeling that you are not being heard. We pride ourselves on the fact that we keep the forum open to all for suggestions on how to improve. As for the checking to see if everyone has the equipment as per the level they are being promoted to, we keep our eyes open, because it is not only carrying the equipment but bringing it to good use. On trips all the seniors keep their attention towards the budding members to make sure they have their equipment and are actively involved to putting those to good use, only than the promotion is announced after taking a survey among the seniors. Promotions are not made on the whim of one person, but collectively and based on the guidelines we have already posted. You will find these points in writing only in @Carnity, I have driven with many clubs and can guarantee you that you will not find any other club in UAE which can give you in writing what you need to do to grow to the next level. @Carnity is also the only club that will provide you with a certificate once you cross your level from Intermediate onward.

@Carnity is fairly young, only 3 years old and we are constantly striving and bringing about subtle changes to continue in harmony. We do recognise that the delays are not well taken by all in normal conditions, we respect everybody time and are experimenting with ways to establish on time departures. You will soon see the changes being made to establish a better on time departure, rather than having to wait for a few people getting late.

@Javier M your suggestions are valuable and we will review it and definitely try to implement it in the best way possible.

[Javier M]

8 minutes ago, Rahimdad said:

@Xaf and @Javier M thank you for your suggestions.

@Wrangeld I totally agree with your point of view.

I am sorry @Javier M if any of us ever gave you a feeling that you are not being heard. We pride ourselves on the fact that we keep the forum open to all for suggestions on how to improve. As for the checking to see if everyone has the equipment as per the level they are being promoted to, we keep our eyes open, because it is not only carrying the equipment but bringing it to good use. On trips all the seniors keep their attention towards the budding members to make sure they have their equipment and are actively involved to putting those to good use, only than the promotion is announced after taking a survey among the seniors. Promotions are not made on the whim of one person, but collectively and based on the guidelines we have already posted. You will find these points in writing only in @Carnity, I have driven with many clubs and can guarantee you that you will not find any other club in UAE which can give you in writing what you need to do to grow to the next level. @Carnity is also the only club that will provide you with a certificate once you cross your level from Intermediate onward.

@Carnity is fairly young, only 3 years old and we are constantly striving and bringing about subtle changes to continue in harmony. We do recognise that the delays are not well taken by all in normal conditions, we respect everybody time and are experimenting with ways to establish on time departures. You will soon see the changes being made to establish a better on time departure, rather than having to wait for a few people getting late.

@Javier M your suggestions are valuable and we will review it and definitely try to implement it in the best way possible.

@Rahimdad In no way whatsoever I am belittling the effort from you and the rest of the team, Carnity is my family, I was actually saying it as a compliment since in other clubs yes they are more strict but there is also a lot of BS that make it less fun. We can talk about it offline, all I am saying is that we can take the good things that others are implemented without the bad things. But that is also a challenge to find the right balance.

 

Edited March 11, 2020 by Javier M

[Salarios]

I also think having a manual is a great idea. It could be "Carnity's Offroad Essentials Guide", issued in PDF format, and would periodically be updated with new information. The Carnity team has already done an incredible job of creating all the content, so it's just a matter of putting it in a single document, categorizing and indexing it, and making it available for download for every new member. It would also have Carnity's branding and legal disclaimers regarding liability. At the end of the document it could have a multiple choice test, where the reader could do a self-test to ensure they understand the most essential aspects of an off-road drive before they sign up for the drive. 

I've attached RTA's Driving Handbook as a sample. 

RTA_Handbook_-_Light_Motor_Vehicle_(LMV)_-_English.pdf

[Wrangeld]

So I re-read this whole discussion again and it's great food for thought. 

@Xaf is of course correct. A single place where this information can easily be accessed is important. I get that it's about havign documents and not necessarily about people reading them

@Javier M the flexibility and friendliness of Carnity is the DNA that makes it different. We don't want to lose that. We also don't want to be out on a drive where someone else expects you to be the one with all the kit in case they get in trouble. And ... documentation is helpful as long as it empowers correctly. 

@Rahimdad I think sometimes, we probablt underestimate the amount of time and energy the seniors put into managing the club next to the day job. It's clear that promotions can only come when justified by the correct methods (combination of driving and attitude/contribution) but maybe there is a place for seeking additional input from others which would not be seen as an imposition to assist in these areas.  

Happy to help prepare documents if that's what's needed.