Nilakantan Erode

@Gaurav @Looper@Pavel PashkovskiyUltimately the proof is in the pudding! So decided to go for a 20223 Bronco Wildtrak. Of course had some help from some old contacts of mine at Ford...on the final purchase!! @Marco B. @Vivek Khetan @Mark Stark @Mehek Merchant Good to know that there are some bronco folks already here in Carnity. See you all soon!

So my Carnity friends...I have finally got a 2023 Bronco Wildtrak. Thanks @Gaurav@Looper@Rizwanm2 @Gautam Bank @Hisham Masaad @Frederic @Alexanderrr @Stumpy Flowers @Bravoecho @Krishna R @Pavel Pashkovskiy @Benjamin and all others those who had shared their wisdom and tips on the card ...ranging from Pajero, Prado, Patrol, Safari. Rubicon and Bronco. Had something to learn from all your experiences / suggestions. Also explored some of the other chats on the car forums. Lots of insights there! Last time i owned a 4WD in Dubai was 22 year back was when i had a 1997 Mitsubishi Pajero (Classic Green). Used to do some desert drives then but after that it has been only family sedans / other cross overs since 2001 ...once i relocated to Singapore. But it is great to be back here in Dubai after 2 decades. The off road landscape and vehicles have changed a lot. And...some really great offroad communities are here now. Last couple of months have been very exciting as i was looking for my off road car with all the advices, research and test drives . The new car prices (and availability) and used car prices (and the evaluations / conditions) have also been humbling revelations. Was also lucky to get some management contracts at Ford that facilitated the final Bronco purchase and delivery. But had nearly finalized and bought 4 other vehicles! Have been the desert in the heat a couple of time now...and driven a (reluctant and worried!) friend's Nissan Patrol V8. Great experience. And..no nothing happened to his V8 Y62 ..though he was biting his nails (more worried about his car than me!!). Ultimately ..as per my learnings here in the Carnity Forum...it is the driver, temperament, skills (and willingness to continuously learn more from all) and the community (for support and encouragements ) and not entirely about vehicles and modifications. Looking forward to seeing some of you soon!

@IsmailGreat choice. And..,like your clarity and quick decision making! Cheers!!

@Ismailwhen i visited Lexus showroom in Early June...the Lexus GX460 Premier was offered at AED 260K..special offer. Worth checking it now..prices may not have changed that much. Lexus GX460 is after all a high end Prado...with luxury trimmings...marketed as such in US. I have had 2 Lexus in the past but the smaller version RX350 (one of my all time favorite cars) ...and they drive very well and very low maintenance ...very much comparable to the dedicated on road BMWX5 that my wife drives now! of course no off road on them. GX460 seems is much more suited for mild off road / camping etc. If i did not have any off road ambitions or had a dedicated off road vehicle...my own 2nd car would have been Lexus or Grand Cherokee. You seem quite sorted out with your dedicated off road vehicle ...Suzuki!!

@Ismailnice note. Have also looked at the LC300 and Prado though delivery timelines have proved a dampener. for my Offroad post feedback from some carnity folks to my query on buying an suv for offoad… Here are my thoughts on the Prado ‘limited” after my test drives on the off-road capability of Prado ( the more experienced folks here especially @Gaurav@Gautam Banka etc. would give a better feedback) . the bumpers are low and Al Futtaim sales person advised me on Prado EXR or GXR if I want to make modifications for off-road. Probably easier on these trims … more importantly the KDSS on the Prado limited has a risk of breaking down on serious off road (again as per the candid view of the Al Futtaim sales person …with an estimate 20k for repairs…if it gets damaged!!). But yes… he did mention that mild off-roading is fine. Worth checking that out from experts here…if you do for ‘limited’ and looking at serious off-road. Prado “limited” does have lots of feature and creature comforts.. one wants to have good SUV..literally the kitchen sink is thrown in!! Safety features like blind spot, lane change and also some great off-road features crawl control , multi terrain monitor etc. BUT…I wonder how these are relevant if serious off-roading is not recommended on Prado ‘limited’…or maybe I got that wrong!! I leave it to the stalwarts at carnity for a more dependable feedback.

Yes @Pavel Pashkovskiy the bronco ecosystem is not fully developed (yet) w.r.t. Repairs / spare parts / mods etc . Jeep seems well established and Japanese vehicles have their own ecosystem to take care of repairs and mods. One of my American friends told me that … repairs / spare parts are not that big a concern in US as most folks there have a D.I.Y. Mindse ( unlike here in Middle East where cheaper labour is available)!! Was also reading @Loopercomments on a related bronco thread ‘With dunebashing (vs baja racing) not a large part of the American off-road scene, and focus on national park trails, rock crawling and overlanding focus overall, it will take time for American manufacturers to embed themselves into the driving culture of the desert.’ So True!! And…Bronco Badlands has some good specs but again rock crawling is not the culture here in UAE (quoting directly from a Al tayer salesperson!!). Guess they are positioning it wrongly . Rubicon also has similar specs but is not held back by lack of ‘ Rock crawl’ culture!! for the time being .. nothing is going to be no change in the desertscape … as there is hardly any supply / delivery of broncos (ignoring limited ones in the pre owned market) and the latest from dealer is that none will be released soon as there is a recall in place for broncos because of a seat belt issue and that needs to be be fixed before new cars are delivered!!

Appreciate any views / thoughts on Ford Bronco...especially the Wildtrak and Badlands models...for offroad (especiually dune / deserrt driving in UAE. Positioned as a strong competitor to Wrangler / Rubicon. Test Drive was great (but of course on road only!!). Seems to bridge the On road / Off road (at least from specs) balance...but with a slightly (!!) higher price tag .. And...repairs and resale untested. Don't think this will challenge / displace the UAE Dune premier league dominated by FJ , Prado / LC, Safaris etc but nevertheless worth a look.

@Gaurav. Thanks. Will certainly start a new thread for Bronco. Dont see too many on the road here in Dubai since it has only been here since 2021 and limited supplies) .Most reviews and videos are still heavily US focused / biased (that is US offroad is not so much Desert / Dunes!).

@Gautam BankaLet me know how i can reach you? Can have a chat on prado..if you are still keen on selling the same. My email is [email protected] and i can be reached on +971547802888. @Gaurav and @Frederic have made some good points...especially on service / warranty / insurance and repairs on non gcc specs. And...you had earlier mentioned that you had already made some modifications to your prado...correct? and that these mods are ready for intermediate level. @Gauravhad also mentioned the same earlier. And...while on the subject of choosing a car (dont shoot me folks!)..any thoughts on Bronco Wildtrak? The test drives were fun. Price not so much.! some preowned 2021 / 2022 with low mileage are available!

Thanks @Gautam Banka Appreciate the thought. Will connect: New Prado is still a couple of months away at Al futtaim….so would be good to checkout good preowned ones! I did some test drives on Bronco and seem to like that. New ones are not available right now ( same issues on delivery as Toyotas!) but seen a couple of decent pre owned broncos… price is a different issue though! And….managed to get some offer on new wrangler rubicon … with some old management connections. The search continues but hope to be ready for the desert drives by September!!

@Gaurav@Frederic@Looper@Hisham Masaad@Gautam Banka Thanks to you and so many others from the Carnity forum for giving your unbiased and candid views and feedback on my query to buy off road vehicle. Gained some valuable insights and knowledge. Did not anticipate this when i asked the question. Simply awesome folks... And great community! After checking a few preowned and new vehicles and frustrating some sellers and car dealer salesmen ...have decided to go for a new one ( i want to have some level of control over repairs and warranty!). The pre owned prices for FJC (new ones are not available anyway) and LC Prado are quite high...in my opinion. same for other 1-3 year pre owned vehicles. My final choices are (taking to consideration offroad capability plus maint plus resale etc.) : 2023 Prado GXR (or VXR) with a delivery of minimum 3 months (but is summer anyway) . @Gautam Banka had mentioned that some modifications may be required for intermediate and beyond approx 30K! Would be good to get some more info on stock prado and modifications required! or as @Gauravhad suggested may go for a 2023 Wrangler Rubicon (after managing to get a contact for some discounts)...and stock may be good enough. Its is also readily available. Would like to know of any limitations / caution in taking a new wrangler off road! Had fun though test driving (on-road)lots of vehicles including Bronco and nissan patrols. Cant rent a car in Dubai to take a car off road else would have liked to try that or maybe join join carnity folks for a drive or at least take some training / refreshers. But that will have to wait.

@Gaurav True that!!😀

@AlexanderrrYes..Thats ideal. Have done test drives on few vehicles that i have shortlisted (New as well as preowned). Ultimately...want to be comfortable with the choice as this will be part of my life for some time!! Like the comments by some of the other folks here..that there is pros and cons on every vehicle. And..Taking a leaf out of Lance Armstrong's autobiography "Its not about the bike" (he is the winner of the Tour de France a record seven consecutive times ). Here it will be "Its not about the SUV"!! People have said it in this forum that more than the vehicle it will be the driving skills that needs to be given lots more time and thought. And ... am sure Carnity community will help!!

@GauravGreat insights. Takes the steam out of Land Cruiser and Nissan Patrol a bit!. Hopefully the dealer will not see this post. I was also impressed and influenced by the LC & NP spectacle shown by the safari companies. Clearly...there is lot more to it. Great learning!!

@Krishna R Yes. I hear you! Y62 v6 dropped out of my picks! And...valid points on popular hybrid cars and getting higher on offload capability curve (nice terminology!) and sticking to a budget!! No end to mods!! @LooperAwesome statistics. The Big4 and the long tail (poor Isuzu...barely hanging on!). Nice to see the Merc. Time to get my BMW on the chart as well (wont tell my wife!). But..Yes..Can see a clear topper in wranglers (okay i am having my eyes on one now..so the bias ) and surprisingly (actually maybe not) ...Pajeros. lots of references made earlier on Pajero and XTerra having their proof here. Couple of more drives and FJ will take the pole!!

@Pavel Pashkovskiy Getting a bit clearer now. Want more off-road capability as my other car is a good city car. Like your point related to FJ (should also apply to couple of other dedicated 3 door off-road vehicles i guess) on having no supporters or more importantly...no advisors!!

@Stumpy PajAwesome post indeed. Was a good read and a Fun ride (read) by itself with some hidden (or more obvious ) pearls of wisdom. And..i second @Fredericfor the award. If i end up buying the Mall crawler (!)...the Vox ticket is on me (MI - dead Reckoning is releasing soon!!). Like you said ..all have pros and cons and sooner or later ...will feel the urge to change the car / upgrade / modify...and contribute to the economy. or some lucky Carnity person may get an opportunity to try out a preowned car (at my expense)...when the next such post is released!!! @Bravoechoyes..Can now understand the shortlist well. I am also a compulsive Excel person...though that is only confusing me. Easier to read the posts here and go for the test drives and make some dealer salesperson frustrated (or see preowned cars and wonder what is going on with the prices!) @FredericLike your segmentation...would add more ...but that would only confuse everyone more...starting with me! Problem is the cost of moving from one segment to other with the investments involved in time and $s. Need some zen thinking and clear my mind. And for that i need to go deep into the desert and need a good Off roader (to come back). The off road vehicle search continues..or should say..going to start!!

@Gautam Banka thanks for the perspectives on Prado. Seems difficult to get a good one in the PREOWNED market these days and new ones have long delivery time : but will continue to look out.

@Gaurav Well said and thanks for your candid comments. Did not realise the drop in front and rear bumper on Pajero signature. And… yes… with more focus on off-road sooner or later (as this is the 2nd car) got to draw a line on the mall crawler requirements. On Y62… don’t want to spend more and learn more on navigating dunes in the same better to spend that time in quality off-road drives. I will have a look at the FJC. Wife already has her choice . I just need to get myself a good Offroader and live with some limitations in city driving. @Pavel Pashkovskiy wrangler is very much in play. But… was not sure of the price and will look around for a good PREOWNED wrangler and FJC. Agree on safari …great off-road vehicle but I will look at other options as a personal preference!

Thanks Folks. Appreciate the feedback. Very useful. Lots to think about. Feels great to get these views and be part of the community already. @Krishna RThis is my 2nd car. I work from home... so whereas city driving will be there this should be a good off road vehicle especially when i wont have access to my primary vehicle (often used by my wife). I like the Y62 but as stated above...have concerns on the heaviness). @Frederic Pajero does look like a good option. Used to own this late 90s (when i used to live and work in Dubai in a different / simpler times) but that time i was a light / casual off roader. Don't think Carnity existed that time. Not sure of support / spare parts for Pajero with Mitsubishi deciding to stop production. should be okay for a few years...i guess! The Wrangler is good...but is not passing the wife approval test (critical stakeholder) for city driving!. Nissan V6 VTC..is of course very popular and proven off-road but if i start using this for city ...not that comfortable. And ..again ...not something that would pass the wife test easily. Titanium V6..seems good for city ...even my wife likes it...but therein lies the catch..as i do feel that stock car may not do for dune bashing. Tough choices! @Benjaminyes...doing some scenarios on city / off road usage. this is the key. Wrangler is good...just have to get some critical stakeholder across the line. @Rizwanm2Am on the look out for good used Prado / LC. not been easy to spot. Not surprised...but search will continue. @Gaurav Rubicon does sound attractive...but i don't want to be overambitious. maybe can start with Sport / Sahara and have off some $s. Will think about Patrol SWB. FJ sounds interesting. No new stcok though and will need to looout for used / preowned. Don't understand the visibility issue but will check out. I do like the Prado / LC options but . need to wait for a good one. New ones are anyway 2-3 months away at least. @Hisham MasaadWill check FJC. Prado ...need to search more...new ones not avalbl readily and need to search more thoroughly for a good used one. At his point of time...Pajero is one option ...relatively new and lowest cost option in my set. Wrangler Sahara is another one...off road credentials are good ignoring relatively less city comfort and resale later . Will try to understand Y62 limitations and costs to make it fully off-road capable (cant believe i am saying this about a Patrol). City / casual off-road is fine for the stock vehicle i guess... ignoring fuel efficiency! And not sure i should be locking in this much in a new vehicle. Need to also explore used vehicle options further. But some of the above feedback and other views in the forum provides a good starting point. Am certainly better off than i was a couple of days back when i was wondering how to start my off-road vehicle buying journey. Again...lots of things to explore. The forum has given some good points to think about. A week back...I was not sure how / where i should start in my off road vehicle hunt. Feeling much better now!

Have read through many of the posts and would request some views in buying a stock SUV for off-road. This is to be used for a bit of city driving (but as a 2nd car) and definitely week end off road. I have got some new car options to start with (based on immediate or 4-5 weeks availability (hence not listing Toyota and some other SUVs). Will start my research on pre owned / used vehicles soon. 1. Mitsubishi Pajero 2020 signature V6.. NEW with some minimal (<100 km) from Al Habtoor PREOWNED division… with warranty until 2026. Price AED 125-130K. Seems good price but not sure if I need to do some modifications for dune drives / off-road. 2. Jeep Wrangler Sahara V6 - NEW from Trading Enterprises. 3yrs Service + 5 yrs warranty . Price AED 240k. Not sure if maint / resale especially if I move out of UAE in 3-4 years) 3. Nissan patrol Super safari V6 VTC 4.7L. NEW from Arabian. 1-2 month delivery. price AED 210K plus 3yrs Service / 5 yrs Warranty . Good off-road reputation but fuel efficiency seems very low! 4. Nissan Patrol SE titanium V6. NEW from Arabian plus 3 yrs Service 5 yrs Warranty. Price AED 260K. Seems heavy and not sure if this will be an over kill. Also not sure if maint. Do let me know your views. Hopefully I can close out something and join you folks on off-road trips soon! Cheers… Neel