Rollover Analysis

[Rahimdad]

Thank you @Zed for remembering and following my advise. The Nagra dune is cursed and we always face incidents but mostly on the back side.

I'm glad you're safe but I felt that you were too close to the Jeep in front and some distance would have avoided the distraction and maybe allowed you to exit quicker.

[M.Seidam]

@Zed Alhamdulellah . First of all thank God that you are good . For the lapse in memory this is normal after the shock and gradually it will resolve God Well.

I agree about all what have been said previously and nothing much to add except one thing , simulation to what has happened . Please if you allow me to paste a clip here that might be of analogue but in low speed at newbie level .

This might help you remember and in slow motion where was the problem 

In my humble opinion this what I think :

normally we are following the car in front , when the Jeep suddenly deviated your eyes followed the Jeep consequently your reaction would put the input to follow. Apparently you felt you are to close to it and wanted to steer bit later to avoid it and that’s why there was slowing down which created fish tail which needed more acceleration and more to left steering to correct. This particular step came late and the flipping already had begun as the front wheels were not aligned with the direction of the momentum.

Mohamed 

Edited November 30, 2020 by Mohamed Seidam

[Zed]

Thank you all and to @Mohamed Seidam for giving another spot-on advice there. I really love the community wisdom from different perspectives here 👍👍👍

I also remember another thing, which is visible from the time stamp at around 11:30 noon. We were done at Nagra Hill, this was probably 2-3km from the highway as we are exiting and concluding our morning drive. I guess the heat and the hunger for lunch made all of us speed more than we should have done. Another lesson learned, when it's time to leave the dunes and racing back to the highway, do it just as we enter: in a nice slow fun fashion and not too rushed to catch some appointment.

Thank you all, looking forward to rejoin Carnity Sweihan and Khatim drives next year 😄

[topgear]

@Zedglad that you are ok and hopefully your 4x4 will be fixed soon. Thanks for sharing such educational video as a reminder and lesson learn, especially for beginners like me who are still learning the art of offroading.

[Anish S]

On 11/30/2020 at 4:59 PM, Zed said:

Even better @Gaurav, here's 5-mins video before the rollover.

See, it started off just fine like any other Solar Park drives, flat then up-down 😄 ... as we say, it's nasib... what's meant to happen just happens

Sorry for the incident and glad to know that you are safe. Based on the video, i personally think that a longer approach was needed to climb especially when you have a heavier vehicle. The approach and angle to climb the dune look sharp, it was a too sudden climb to actually gain enough momentum to slide slope, criss cross or ridge ride.

You will notice there was another track few meters before you started the climb, it is better to take a smoother path by starting to climb earlier and gradually with enough momentum.  If there is a loss of momentum and if you are fishtailing, steer down smoothly towards the tail and descend. Lastly, in such situation, sudden turn and brake are very risky.

Thank you for sharing the video @Zed, so we all can keep learning... 

Edited December 1, 2020 by Anish S

[Gaurav]

Apologies @Zed for late comment.

Everyone has made awesome points and all are valid in there own way of approach.

My request to view 30 secs prior was in an attempt to see and observe the attitude of lead car, which @Anish S has indirectly pointed above. Let me elaborate more on that now.

I have seen this happening all my life that when friends, family and colleague plan a drive then everyone running with a ego battle to prove a point to one another over their cars, car mod or drive style supremacy. I myself did this exact same behavior when I was new in offroading to an uncle who use to pester me on every family event that you kids don't know offroading and we have seen and done enough. So on first drive to prove my point I was knowing or unknowingly driving like a maniac without considering his LWB against my SWB and on his every refusal I was wondering where he has been driving to have such glorified tales in every party. Same happen few times with my office colleague and after that I stopped going with all my friends, family and colleague to not to get into ego battle.

Point here is I personally don't know your lead, but from his driving style he was totally unaware that he had Y62 in his convoy and still he was attempting to break a single use crest almost every time and that too from a very short distance which will make a struggle for Y62 to cross. Secondly from above video crest entries and exits was of Intermediate level and not at all of Newbie or fewbie level. On the dune you rolled over, wrangler in front of you has a refusal and you think u were distracted but I feel if wrangler had a refusal on a "SINGLE USE SOFT SAND CREST" then you had a zero percent chance to make it. In my humble view (no disrespect intended) you kept on fight with mother nature on soft sand crest to prove some point and then it was too late for you to steer downward and due to sand wall already in place of left tire resulted in rollover. Even when you have failed to prove your point, if you would have left the gas, you would have had a nasty stuck, but that could have been much better than a roll over.

For future, if ever you still wish to drive with same or similar friends you should be able to gauge their driving style in first 5 mins and if its same as above, then adjust your driving to consider Y62 LWB and weight. When I had Land Cruiser LWB in such drives half of the crest, ridge riding I use to skip knowing my vehicle limitation and boat size length.

I'm really glad that you are fine and that is the most important, as cars are just a piece of metal that can be repaired eventually. Take it easy have fun and drive safe.

[Abu Muhammad]

Alhamdulillah ‘ala salamatik ya akhee @Zed. I am sad to find out about this and also I thank you for sharing your experience so we can all learn and let this be a lesson for me first and foremost so we should listen to our leader’s advise before things go bad at least try our best InshaAllah. Once again Thanks Allah azzawajal that your are okay which is most important. 

[Zed]

On 12/4/2020 at 5:25 PM, Gaurav said:

In my humble view (no disrespect intended) you kept on fight with mother nature on soft sand crest to prove some point and then it was too late for you to steer downward and due to sand wall already in place of left tire resulted in rollover. Even when you have failed to prove your point, if you would have left the gas, you would have had a nasty stuck, but that could have been much better than a roll over.

Thanks @Gaurav , this is some awesome Fatherly advice there! Now that I think of it, yes, I had the option of skipping the top crest by going sideways and continue following from below. But why did I kept on following the convoy?!?!?!? Haha, strange how Ego is undetected within oneself, but easily pointed out by (usually a more senior) person with experience. This is a very good lesson learned indeed, thank you again Gaurav Ji!

[Alexander Alcala]

I have rolled over twice in my life and that is the kind of memories that never go away from your head.  I learned much more from my mistakes than from my successes.  Luckily nothing serious happened (that can not be repaired).

But regarding the video: I also wonder if you lifted the foot while trying to go down.  With no gas, the steering is not responsive.  That is another posible issue.

[dune jockey]

On 11/30/2020 at 4:59 PM, Zed said:

Even better @Gaurav, here's 5-mins video before the rollover.

See, it started off just fine like any other Solar Park drives, flat then up-down 😄 ... as we say, it's nasib... what's meant to happen just happens

Very informative footage @Zed

From What I see all of you were doing flat grounds pretty comfortably in the initial 3-4 min, then you started to push your cars .

We all emphasize often that there is no contest / competition when on drives, but somehow everyone (including me) can get carried away. You learnt it the hard way, but I am sure you will come back a better driver . We all make and learn from our mistakes

Edited December 7, 2020 by Chaitanya D