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@Looper@Gary F@Benjamin any inputs on this ? Doesn’t the Jeep stay on rev limiter while flooring in first gear ? Or do you guys play with the throttle to keep it just before it hits the limiter ? My trooper has no limit . 😜

Another fantastic drive @Frederic. It is always a pleasure to be your S/L. Along with a terrific line-up of support from @Imran Asghar, @Zed, @Dodi Syahdar, and @Srikumar. It was a pleasure to meet you Sri, after so much time with the club. Looking forward to driving on one of your drives soon. I had our newest club member behind me, @Abhishek Chikara. Well done on your first official drive with us. You drove well and controlled your descent nicely on the way down some of those steep drops. You also had watched well your prep videos because you got yourself inflated without issue. Positive (Red) first then Negative (Black) next. Reverse for disconnecting. @Carl Stanley got a tip on disconnecting ABS and traction control for his Pajero by pulling out the relay. This will give some additional control over your car next time. Frederic wrote about this here: Have a great week ahead and see you next weekend.

@Abhishek Chikara Jeep's handle relatively funny when it comes to climbing especially in different dune environments. The first thing that could be contributing to this rev limiter doing that would potentially be traction control or electronic stability control (more likely) kicking in when you begin to climb. So, when you're in 4H make sure to press and hold the traction control button for 10 seconds shortly after you'll get a charm sound which means TC and ETC are both off (in my early days this was contributing a lot to my issues in climbs I was just turning off TC) Now if you have already done that and your engine is still limiting your revs try using Tiptronic manual on all the large climbs you'll want to be in 1st gear until 5000 rpms change to second (remember to let off the throttle anytime you change gears, it makes a large difference when you lay back down on the power) once you begin to drop in second gear switch back to first repeating the same foot-work. (Sometimes in the jeeps the gear change acts a little off if you just lay on the accelerator my take is some software preventing throttle within the change of gears but I'm unsure) If you're still facing the same problem, there are two things you can do. Either you're in 4H auto and the computer is learning this more aggressive driving style (high likelihood) so more drives = computer adapts better to your command in the future. or you can try using 4H part-time. (FYI 4 auto is 4 wheels turning based on computer processing where to send the power 4 part-time is 4 wheels spinning all the time) my recommendation is to stay in 4H auto though. Overall, I've faced your issue before, and I think you can eliminate that rev cut by using both tiptronic gears and correct foot-work into your climbs to maximize momentum and rev issues. on a side-note practice on flat-ground to figure out which RPM and gear gives you the most initial torque that will also make a world of a difference by changing your gears within the right RPM threshold. Keep an eye on coolant temp 110 degrees is overheating

There are 2 options from experience in this case for the 3.8L as the loss of power is due to having passed the 5500 rpm. Option 1: Triptronic at first gear: Try not to let the engine pass the 5500 rpm which is tricky and with time you will be able to spot that twilight zone from the sound of the engine as you wont have time to look at the rpm because in parallel you need to do little lefts and rights to keep the traction going. Option 2: Get a LOT of momentum to get you in second gear and climb as high as you can (i know easier said than done) and then shift back to first to give you that needed push at the top. The challenge in this option is to find the sweet spot to know when to downshift to keep the optimal rev level. My advice is to ease off the gas just a bit when downshifting as the substantial added torque at the downshift lets you dig rather than propel you forward and then floor it. You have to find that place where just enough throttle is needed to keep the momentum going and then floor it again. I could be sharing things that you probably already know, if not, hope this helps others as well.

POST OF THE YEAR. So perfectly elaborated!!

Dear @Mahesh_, @Andrew John Melvill, @Imteeaz, @RiadJL, @Benjamin. It have been nice to see you all again after some time everyone drove really good , the weather was acceptable but a bit windy . The first half consisted of the warmup and practicing and wakening up our maneuver instincts by going through some awkward and angles before hitting the sharp edges and the tall dunes. we slowly increased the pace over those wonderful dunes, till we stopped for the break. unfortunately, the 2nd have was not as fun as the 1st half of the drive as i got my front tire slashed by a rock and we had to practice changing the spare tire process 😂. after we fixed @Mahesh_ pop out i decided to exit at 2nd of December. Thanks @Benjamin and @Imteeaz for the support and @Mahesh_ for the Sweep looking forward to see you again

The above seems to be estimated torque curve for JL in first gear. So it seems it's not productive to go beyond the 5000 rpm point. The best way to is to anticipate the gear and climb and generate enough momentum and keep the pedal modulated (not flooring) to keep the rpm between 4000-5000.

No problem! and yes, I do feather the throttle depending on what I'm doing. sometimes feathering my torquey RPM in 1st gear helps me climb at a slower pace (that's better for small climbs or sand walls) typically on high climbs I would feather 2nd gear around 3000-5000 RPM before considering changing to first. The computer does automatically cut engine power which is why there is a sudden pause in the throttle after changing gears, the extreme heat does affect the CPU's processing speed. Lift and Coast has helped a bunch within gear changing in my experience though. however, do experiment and find the technique that works best for you

Lots of different techniques for many situations. tbh any car may perform better using that technique just like correct trail-braking in the sand! haha Thank you @Frederic!!

Great question and the subject of many discussions on the sand and here in the forums. Completely agree with @Zubail and concur that @Frederic has mentioned this a lot in the past. From my experience, my previous Pajero, 3.5L 2013, would not stop or lose power in 1st. She'd keep going, which was great. The White Rhino, 3.8L 2020 does lose power at the very top and I've learned on taller dunes to ease off the gas just a bit to prevent that from happening.

@Abhishek Chikara i'm sure once you reach Fewbie you'll have found your answer 😊 very hard to describe but the short answer is: practice makes perfect 👍🏻

Thank you for your kind words @Emanuel

Thanks all, great drive 👍

First is going @Zed on video, then me, and JPL

Indeed. 😃

Hello. I had a question from yesterday’s drive and would appreciate any guidance from the seniors. While going up the big dune (where we went up, made a left and came down two times), my car was losing momentum in 2nd gear so I stayed in 1st gear. Due to lack of experience, I had my foot pressed on the pedal at all times. As a result, I would hit the rev limiter, engine would cut the power, revs would drop down to 5ish thousand but since my foot stayed planted, as soon as power was back, I would again hit the limiter and the process repeated. As a result, it was a jerky ride up with power cutting in and out. I am sure what I did was not right and maybe a better approach, in hindisght, would've been to feather the throttle on the way up but wanted to get your thoughts on the same. Thanks.

We request every member that joins this drive to go through the information below and strictly follow these guidelines, etiquette and responsibilities. MUST READ AND COMPLY Environmental Policy Offroad Flag Guideline Two Way Radio Guideline Off road Driving Etiquettes Emergency details for all off roaders Off Road Driving - Roles & Responsibilities DRIVE DETAILS Level: Fewbie and above When: 21 Sept 2024, Saturday Meeting time: 6:00 AM - Sharp Meeting Point: https://maps.app.goo.gl/eTX8wtibrfhsXS6D6 Approximate finish time: 10:00 AM Type of Car: Any proper 4x4 with front and back tow hooks and 8-10 inches of ground clearance. What to bring along: Loads of water, snacks (for yourself), smiles, enthusiasm, and willingness to learn. RECOMENDED OFF-ROAD GEAR: Tire deflator & Tire pressure gauge Compressor (MANDATORY) Walkie-talkie radio (MANDATORY) Off-road flag (MANDATORY) Shovel, Tow Rope & 2 Shackles First-aid kit Fire extinguisher LIMITED SPOTS AVAILABLE This drive is limited to 10 cars only. RSVP will close on Friday - 12 PM. If the RSVP is full, you can add your name to the waitlist, once anyone drops, you will be moved to the RSVP list. RSVP will close a day prior to preparing a convoy list. Latecomers will be returned - Without any exceptions. Members without RSVP will be returned - Without any exceptions. Please withdraw your RSVP, if you aren't joining, so your spot can be taken by others. Repeated no-show members after RSVP will have their account suspended for a month. PLEASE RSVP ON THE CALENDAR

My training ground was Big Red. It’s the best place to get the highest ROI on mastering both options. Just Food for thought next time you’re in that area.

What you are doing is correct as settings: ESC - long press 7 seconds - complete off - Electronic Stability Control Module. 4H Part time in proper dunes is the best with 50:50 power split, as 4H Auto is for mild off-road where power shifts from 30:70 split to 10:90 (Front:Rear) based on your speed. Ideally, you should always drive an auto car in D, as much as you can to stay focused on track and techniques. That's how car automatics learn and improvise to serve you better over long run. Driving all the time in a manual, you will mostly over-run the gears and generate more heat for transmission oil. Use manual (mostly 1st gear) for long hill climbs. Now scenario for long hill climbs differs from Shj and Dxb VS AD. So for moderate size of dunes (Shj and Dxb) 1st gear should be mostly enough. For huge dunes like in AD, you should start with 2 second gear: Either continue in 2nd gear, all the way up. OR downshift to 1 when RPM drops below 4K and but before 3K. You can also try that infamous "off-road" button on your Rubicon on such difficult climbs, as some owners reported that optimizes gear response, but the actual truth is yet to be discovered.

Thanks @Mike M.. Option 1 is under perfection at the moment and I'm getting close to being at one with the twilight zone. The tip for Option 2 is something I'm going to try this weekend.

Great. It is crystal clear now. I will try it the way you’re suggesting the next time! Thanks again and really appreciate your guidance.

Thanks @Benjamin for the detailed reply. Apologies, I should have given some background with my post. Before starting the drive, I - Turn off Traction Control + ESC (pressing it until I hear the sound and it shows it is off on the screen) - I always use 4H part time (not 4H Auto) on the desert - Put gear box in manual and keep moving between 1st and 2nd and occasionally the 3rd if speed sustains on flatter grounds (have never used D on the desert) I will try what you are suggesting i.e., take my foot off while changing to 2nd from 1st gear since I did not do that under the impression that the computer automatically cuts the power off when the gear changes happen. Throughout the climb, my foot was pressed hard against the pedal at all times (hence, the power kept cutting and reappearing). Out of curiosity - do you feather the throttle as well on climbs or do you just lift the feet while changing gears? Once again, thanks for the detailed reply.

Never new JeeP is sooo complicated

Great. Thanks Zubail. Appreciate your reply.

It depends on the car, I remember once was going on big dune and in the middle of it was loosing power, then realized I was on 3rd gear, I limited to 2nd - it was amazing! Yesterday I did on 2nd, but also tried on 1st, so yesterday I learned, that for my car 1st gear only if smth bigger will be, but that kiid of dunes on 2nd gear is fine. As @Fredericsaid to me on one of my first drives, each car is a different animal, and how to manage it - you have to practice.

That was me 😁

Hey @Frederic, I did register for the drive and even at midnight I was shown as on waiting list. Also was expecting an email of confirmation which I didn’t receive. Morning I came to know I was accepted. Would like to join you guys in the next one.

You did well on your first official drive with Carnity.

@J-P L @Zubail Uploaded a video of you guys riding the tall dune. There are two other cars in the video but not sure who they are. The last car is black Jeep, I believe it could be @Mehmet Volga or @Sumedh Krishna Al Ajban - tall dune

Thanks for the amazing first drive @Frederic! I enjoyed it thoroughly and look forward to many more. Also, would like to thank again @Imran Asghar, @Emanuel and @S Kumar for the constant support and guidance during the drive and for being very patient with my questions!! Best Abhishek

Another drive that lived up to it's name, a lovely fast paced roller-coaster thanks @Simon D! A big thanks to the support team of @Imteeaz and @Benjamin for the advice and working hard with the flat tire and pop out! To @RiadJL and @Mahesh_ great to drive with you guys again, always good! All in a very good Sunday morning!

with love

That is a real Fredy's signature.

@Brett Eicher, something for you: @Zed some more snaps of your impostor... I keep hearing your cutoff when you were going up that bowl, amazing @Alexanderrr, I somehow managed to catch only one shot of your beast: @RiadJL and his 392: @DP1011 of course: @Nizar Shawwa hope you'll like it: @Mahmut, I shared all of hi-res with you already Photogenic red as always: Who did I miss?

Thanks @Frederic It was wonderful drive, not only because of scenic and rout, but as @Mike M. mentioned Carnity spirit! Was happy to see you all!

Thanks @Frederic for today’s drive. The track was flowing like water. A perfect and balanced mix between some play and a fluid drive. Couldn’t have been a better one. Thank you to all the supporting members as well. Everyone was all over the convoy and specifically the new joiners like an iron net. To all the new members that joined @Carnity, this spirit and mentality of passing it forward is what makes this club unique. It’s not about extreme driving or a chest pumping contest, it really boils down to this specific point which is the community feel and team spirit. Freddy, one more, no pressure

Dear Mr. Ale , Davie and all supporters teams members . thanks for yesterday drive , really I have enjoyed and all the member spent a nice time with full of experience. wish to meet all of you shortly.

Hi @Zubail, it was fantastic, did a beach camp, we were very fortunate to have a very nice breeze the whole evening with little humidity and of course regularly in and out the water to keep cool - with an early departure... The desert is still to hot for me for an overnight especially with kids, next would be to try one of the wadi's... (will try the desert before the end of the month though... )

@Ale Vallecchi great drive yesterday really enjoyed the challenges set forth and I believe we managed several of the goals we set ourselves. Well done to all the team members @essam ibrahim @MICHAEL PAJERO single door @Matt - monkeywrench @Cesar Chacon @Jon L And our sweep @Gary F you all drove brilliantly to achieve what we did. Great support from @Gary F as always your calmness and professionalism shown through as we tackled a couple of Stucks and a pop out. have a great rest of you weekend and hope to see you all in the sand real soon as the winter season will be on us very soon. 😀😀

Sorry for the late response, about the rear shocks, I was wrong, it has to be installed that way because if the rebound knob was facing the wheel you will not be able to rotate it due to small available space. It seems like the front shocks have no rebound setting (so it is a 2-way adjustment not 3) because if there is one, to reach it you will have to remove the battery in one side and the air intake in the other. I still need a confirmation regarding the front shocks.